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Our greatest problem is that our CIC is a draft dodger.
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!Jones
2017-04-08 18:13:02 UTC
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I was always glad that we weren't at war during the Clinton
administration... Bill was essentially a draft dodger. Bush was a
*little* bit better; he joined the Alabama Air National Guard which,
of course, was close to being a draft dodger without actually moving
to England. Now, we have Trump... who unapologetically bought his
deferments.

So, now he's going to lead us into a war?

"Please, Mr. Custer, I doan wanna go...!"

What does Trump know of sacrifice? His idea of war is a twitter-fit.
His idea of sacrifice is having to postpone his Florida tee-time by a
week while Jared and what's her name are on the ski slopes.

If any serious adversary materialized that required a national
commitment, we'd best be advised to sue for peace and listen to his
terms. Yeah, we have lots of guns, but we're soft, cheeseburger-fed,
children of plenty led into battle by our hero, Jared Cushner, who
never knew any sacrifice in his life. The people who lived through
the Great Depression and stormed Omaha Beach are now gone; the people
we have now are only concerned with *their* rights and won't be able
to go the distance.

I guess it's time to build the wall, get behind it, and hope nobody
lays siege... that's what happens to walls, you know.

Jones
MarcusAurelius
2017-04-08 18:25:58 UTC
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Americans appear to favor draft dodgers over military veterans for political office! There's Presidents Clinton and Trump both of which were draft dodgers. Former Vice President Cheney was a draft dodger. Many of those which are now are elected officials are draft dodgers. I will NOT vote for a draft dodger no matter how much I agree with him politically! That one of the reasons why I did NOT vote for Trump. The other main reason that I did not vote for Trump was that I thought that he was too mentally unstable to be POTUS. In fact, in my opinion, he is too mentally unstable to be in the US Military. Look at how mentally stable former US Supreme Commander in Europe and US President Dwight D. Eisenhower was in times of crisis. Former Presidents George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Franklin Roosevelt,Abraham Lincoln, and Theodore Roosevelt demonstrated that mental stability which is requisite to be POTUS. The American electorate which elected these former great US Presidents no longer exists!
!Jones
2017-04-08 21:23:51 UTC
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On Sat, 8 Apr 2017 11:25:58 -0700 (PDT), in alt.war.vietnam
Post by MarcusAurelius
Americans appear to favor draft dodgers over military veterans for political office! There's Presidents Clinton and Trump both of which were draft dodgers. Former Vice President Cheney was a draft dodger. Many of those which are now are elected officials are draft dodgers. I will NOT vote for a draft dodger no matter how much I agree with him politically! That one of the reasons why I did NOT vote for Trump. The other main reason that I did not vote for Trump was that I thought that he was too mentally unstable to be POTUS. In fact, in my opinion, he is too mentally unstable to be in the US Military. Look at how mentally stable former US Supreme Commander in Europe and US President Dwight D. Eisenhower was in times of crisis. Former Presidents George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Franklin Roosevelt,Abraham Lincoln, and Theodore Roosevelt demonstrated that mental stability which is requisite to be POTUS. The American electorate which elected these former great US Presidents no longer
exists!
"... and, there we were, shaking hands in the middle of the road when
we were run over by a truck!"

I'm not thrilled with Bush(43)'s "service"; however, I suppose it was
possible for him to have been activated.

But, I agree that "the American electorate which elected these former
great US Presidents no longer exists!" We have lost the ability to
discern the truth; it has been sacrificed upon the altar of our
respective ideologies.

Jones
!Jones
2017-04-08 21:44:50 UTC
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On Sat, 8 Apr 2017 11:25:58 -0700 (PDT), in alt.war.vietnam
Post by MarcusAurelius
The American electorate which elected these former great US Presidents no longer exists!
Actually, I think that's a profound statement.

Jones
Klaus Schadenfreude
2017-04-08 18:30:15 UTC
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Post by !Jones
I was always glad that we weren't at war during the Clinton
administration... Bill was essentially a draft dodger. Bush was a
*little* bit better; he joined the Alabama Air National Guard which,
of course, was close to being a draft dodger without actually moving
to England. Now, we have Trump... who unapologetically bought his
deferments.
So, now he's going to lead us into a war?
"Please, Mr. Custer, I doan wanna go...!"
What does Trump know of sacrifice? His idea of war is a twitter-fit.
His idea of sacrifice is having to postpone his Florida tee-time by a
week while Jared and what's her name are on the ski slopes.
If any serious adversary materialized that required a national
commitment, we'd best be advised to sue for peace and listen to his
terms. Yeah, we have lots of guns, but we're soft, cheeseburger-fed,
children of plenty led into battle by our hero, Jared Cushner, who
never knew any sacrifice in his life. The people who lived through
the Great Depression and stormed Omaha Beach are now gone; the people
we have now are only concerned with *their* rights and won't be able
to go the distance.
I guess it's time to build the wall, get behind it, and hope nobody
lays siege... that's what happens to walls, you know.
Military experience isn't required to be President. In fact, it's
unnecessary.

Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
r***@gmail.com
2017-04-09 02:02:35 UTC
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Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
We've said the for years...

redvet
http://www.vvawai.org/
!Jones
2017-04-09 02:53:08 UTC
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On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 11:30:15 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam Klaus
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President. In fact, it's
unnecessary.
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
As POTUS, one is also the commander in chief of all US military
forces; therefore, being a draft dodger is not a particularly good
recommendation.

Jones
Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
2017-04-09 07:52:10 UTC
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Post by !Jones
As POTUS, one is also the commander in chief of all US military
forces; therefore, being a draft dodger is not a particularly good
recommendation.
Well jackass the volunteers should understand someone who
has no desire to be a forced "volunteer", and regardless they
still have an obligation to obey any CIC.

now stop your trolling asshole
;-)
Klaus Schadenfreude
2017-04-09 13:45:40 UTC
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Post by !Jones
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On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 11:30:15 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam Klaus
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President. In fact, it's
unnecessary.
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
As POTUS, one is also the commander in chief of all US military
forces; therefore, being a draft dodger is not a particularly good
recommendation.
It's neither here nor there. You need ZERO military experience to be
commander in chief. In fact, lack of military experience might be more
beneficial. Being a draft dodger is a good indication you're not so
fond of war that you'll want to engage in it at the drop of a hat,
which is what we've been doing for the last two hundred fucking years.
Wiley E. Coyote
2017-04-09 15:39:20 UTC
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Post by !Jones
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On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 11:30:15 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam Klaus
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President. In fact, it's
unnecessary.
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
As POTUS, one is also the commander in chief of all US military
forces; therefore, being a draft dodger is not a particularly good
recommendation.
Jones
What was you're opinion of Bill "the rapist" Clinton? He was alos a renowbed
draft dodger.
!Jones
2017-04-10 00:13:29 UTC
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On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 15:39:20 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley E.
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
What was you're opinion of Bill "the rapist" Clinton? He was alos a renowbed
draft dodger.
Agreed; however, you're changing the subject. Bush(43) and Cheney
also were both essentially draft dodgers; although, George did "serve"
in the Alabama national guard. TTBOMK, Bill Clinton never donned a
military uniform and paraded around as a warrior.

My issue is neither Clinton nor Bush; they're both long out of
office... my issue is Trump rattling the saber without a clue what
he's doing.

Jones
RD Sandman
2017-04-10 20:22:11 UTC
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Post by !Jones
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On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 15:39:20 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley E.
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
What was you're opinion of Bill "the rapist" Clinton? He was alos a
renowbed draft dodger.
Agreed; however, you're changing the subject. Bush(43) and Cheney
also were both essentially draft dodgers; although, George did "serve"
in the Alabama national guard. TTBOMK, Bill Clinton never donned a
military uniform and paraded around as a warrior.
My understanding is that he went to Oxford.
Post by !Jones
My issue is neither Clinton nor Bush; they're both long out of
office... my issue is Trump rattling the saber without a clue what
he's doing.
Even some who served do that.
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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!Jones
2017-04-10 21:53:04 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 15:22:11 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
My understanding is that he went to Oxford.
Am *I* suggesting that Bill Clinton was a great leader?

If I had had the opportunity, I'd have gone to Oxford... as opposed to
Dak To, I mean. If I had it to do over again, I'd immigrate to Canada
instead of going to Vietnam.

If I had done so, would I have gained your vote to be POTUS?

Jones
Chinook Lover
2017-04-10 23:25:22 UTC
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Post by !Jones
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 15:22:11 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
My understanding is that he went to Oxford.
Am *I* suggesting that Bill Clinton was a great leader?
If I had had the opportunity, I'd have gone to Oxford... as opposed to
Dak To, I mean. If I had it to do over again, I'd immigrate to Canada
instead of going to Vietnam.
If I had done so, would I have gained your vote to be POTUS?
Jones
Dak To had running water if you got into the river Kontum had the Dak
Bla which seemed to encircle the town.

hey I'd vote for ya
--
"they called him 'stumpy' and his kidneys were end-stage as well. we
gonna try fistula surgery again...a little higher up"

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!Jones
2017-04-11 00:59:40 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 18:25:22 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
Dak To had running water if you got into the river Kontum had the Dak
Bla which seemed to encircle the town.
hey I'd vote for ya
Yeah, right! If you got into the river, you were a good hundred yards
outside of the perimeter and likely to be found floating in that same
river later in the day.

Dak To made Canada look pretty good. Of course, being born with
billions of dollars would be better. Who knows; I just might grow up
and be the president!

Jones
Chinook Lover
2017-04-11 01:14:05 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 18:25:22 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
Dak To had running water if you got into the river Kontum had the Dak
Bla which seemed to encircle the town.
hey I'd vote for ya
Yeah, right! If you got into the river, you were a good hundred yards
outside of the perimeter and likely to be found floating in that same
river later in the day.
Dak To made Canada look pretty good. Of course, being born with
billions of dollars would be better. Who knows; I just might grow up
and be the president!
Jones
Dak To made the 4th Infantry appreciate Camp Enari in Pleiku
--
"they called him 'stumpy' and his kidneys were end-stage as well. we
gonna try fistula surgery again...a little higher up"

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!Jones
2017-04-11 01:34:54 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 20:14:05 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
Dak To made the 4th Infantry appreciate Camp Enari in Pleiku
I was at Holloway and everybody thought it was the pits of hell; I
guess they never got up to Dak To... did that godfersaken compound
even *have* a name? I was never so glad to get out of a place in my
young live... or since!

Show me a man who is applauding the Syrian bombardment and I'll show
you a person who has never heard in inbound Katyusha on its downhill
run.

Jones
Chinook Lover
2017-04-11 01:45:48 UTC
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Post by !Jones
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 20:14:05 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
Dak To made the 4th Infantry appreciate Camp Enari in Pleiku
I was at Holloway and everybody thought it was the pits of hell; I
guess they never got up to Dak To... did that godfersaken compound
even *have* a name? I was never so glad to get out of a place in my
young live... or since!
Show me a man who is applauding the Syrian bombardment and I'll show
you a person who has never heard in inbound Katyusha on its downhill
run.
Jones
or had his water tower a/c warning lights used as an aiming stake for
whatever the bad guys had in store for the airbase that night. pls no
short rounds tonight thank you very much
--
"they called him 'stumpy' and his kidneys were end-stage as well. we
gonna try fistula surgery again...a little higher up"

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!Jones
2017-04-11 02:07:08 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 20:45:48 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
or had his water tower a/c warning lights used as an aiming stake for
whatever the bad guys had in store for the airbase that night. pls no
short rounds tonight thank you very much
Heh!

"Goddamnit! I wish our cowardly CO would get off his spineless duff
and get us out there in the field more... I wanna kick some ass!
Let's go out in the jungle!"

I actually heard a few kids say that... it was always *before* they
actually got their wish, though. The problem with "getting some
action" is that you usually get more than you want. "The elephant"
did not live up to my expectations!

I cringe when I hear all of these warrior-types talking about what a
great leader Trump is... he doesn't have a *clue*. The round meant
for him will blow his little blonde muff's brains all over him, then
we'll see how glorious he thinks it all is.

Jones
dino
2017-04-11 02:06:51 UTC
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Post by !Jones
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 18:25:22 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
Dak To had running water if you got into the river Kontum had the Dak
Bla which seemed to encircle the town.
hey I'd vote for ya
Yeah, right! If you got into the river, you were a good hundred yards
outside of the perimeter and likely to be found floating in that same
river later in the day.
What perimeter? When I was there the Sneaky Petes had a small camp and there
was an airfield next to it. We had flown in and were waiting to hike out or fly
out to the surrounding hills when I was making friends with the dog that was
with us. The dog handler saw a great opportunity and said he would like to test
his dog and asked if I would go out in the bushes and see if his dog could track
me. Well, hells bells, no one ever accused me of being too goddamned smart but
I am not THAT stupid!
!Jones
2017-04-11 02:08:14 UTC
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On 10 Apr 2017 19:06:51 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam dino
Post by dino
What perimeter?
Wasn't it *you*?

Jones
dino
2017-04-11 02:16:36 UTC
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Post by !Jones
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On 10 Apr 2017 19:06:51 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam dino
Post by dino
What perimeter?
Wasn't it *you*?
Jones
No. We were just there. We weren't dug in or occupying any foxholes or
bunkers. But it was just till we went out in the hills. That's where the fun
was...
!Jones
2017-04-11 02:18:50 UTC
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On 10 Apr 2017 19:16:36 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam dino
Post by dino
No. We were just there. We weren't dug in or occupying any foxholes or
bunkers. But it was just till we went out in the hills. That's where the fun
was...
Yeah, I heard you guys had lots of fun up there. Must have been a
real chuckle-fest.

Jones
!Jones
2017-04-11 02:16:50 UTC
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On 10 Apr 2017 19:06:51 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam dino
Post by dino
What perimeter? When I was there the Sneaky Petes had a small camp and there
was an airfield next to it. We had flown in and were waiting to hike out or fly
out to the surrounding hills when I was making friends with the dog that was
with us. The dog handler saw a great opportunity and said he would like to test
his dog and asked if I would go out in the bushes and see if his dog could track
me. Well, hells bells, no one ever accused me of being too goddamned smart but
I am not THAT stupid!
Well, you're an old fart. Later on, the airfield had a reasonably
decent berm... the high ground just to the west gave 'em a pretty good
shot into it, though.

When the hook dropped me in there, I was on the southeast side of the
strip; if I looked just right, I could barely see the "slope"... and
it wasn't all that far... what? ten clicks or so?

Jones
dino
2017-04-11 02:19:56 UTC
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Post by !Jones
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On 10 Apr 2017 19:06:51 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam dino
Post by dino
What perimeter? When I was there the Sneaky Petes had a small camp and there
was an airfield next to it. We had flown in and were waiting to hike out or fly
out to the surrounding hills when I was making friends with the dog that was
with us. The dog handler saw a great opportunity and said he would like to test
his dog and asked if I would go out in the bushes and see if his dog could track
me. Well, hells bells, no one ever accused me of being too goddamned smart but
I am not THAT stupid!
Well, you're an old fart. Later on, the airfield had a reasonably
decent berm... the high ground just to the west gave 'em a pretty good
shot into it, though.
When the hook dropped me in there, I was on the southeast side of the
strip; if I looked just right, I could barely see the "slope"... and
it wasn't all that far... what? ten clicks or so?
Jones
I doubt if it was that far. 'A' Company left that morning and was walking back
to Dak To. 10 clicks was difficult to do in a day in the jungle.
!Jones
2017-04-11 02:43:30 UTC
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On 10 Apr 2017 19:19:56 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam dino
Post by dino
I doubt if it was that far. 'A' Company left that morning and was walking back
to Dak To. 10 clicks was difficult to do in a day in the jungle.
Well, the way I received the story (at the time, I was still in AIT),
was that Alpha was headed back to Dak To early in the morning and was
expecting to be picked up by trucks on the road... and it wasn't far
to the road. Thus, the thumpers had dropped most of their ammo and
everybody was expecting to be on the trucks in a few minutes...
surprise, surprise, surprise! I guess they had a long day, huh?

About two years later, I went into that site on the ridge to sling a
disabled helicopter out. The bitch was that the whole area was still
lousy with that white powder shit that's like tear gas, but it's
powder. Anyway, when the hook came in to lift the downed bird out, it
kicked it all up in a big cloud. I guess y'all spread that crap to
keep Charles from looting it... it was still there in '69, FYI.

Jones
dino
2017-04-11 04:56:14 UTC
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Post by !Jones
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On 10 Apr 2017 19:19:56 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam dino
Post by dino
I doubt if it was that far. 'A' Company left that morning and was walking back
to Dak To. 10 clicks was difficult to do in a day in the jungle.
Well, the way I received the story (at the time, I was still in AIT),
was that Alpha was headed back to Dak To early in the morning and was
expecting to be picked up by trucks on the road... and it wasn't far
to the road. Thus, the thumpers had dropped most of their ammo and
everybody was expecting to be on the trucks in a few minutes...
surprise, surprise, surprise! I guess they had a long day, huh?
About two years later, I went into that site on the ridge to sling a
disabled helicopter out. The bitch was that the whole area was still
lousy with that white powder shit that's like tear gas, but it's
powder. Anyway, when the hook came in to lift the downed bird out, it
kicked it all up in a big cloud. I guess y'all spread that crap to
keep Charles from looting it... it was still there in '69, FYI.
Jones
Yeah. I mentioned that (about the guys dumping the ammo) on the newsgroup many
years ago and I got hammered big time for saying it. I witnessed it, so fuck
it. Most of the guys who used to post here didn't have a real sense of the
reality of the Vietnam war or just didn't want to admit it. Probably more the
later than the former.

The teargas powder was left spread around in the foxholes so the NVA couldn't
use them. Never did they expect that the NVA could give a fuck less about their
crappy foxholes. Did you ever see NVA dug-in positions? They were masterfully
built to perfection. Yeah, and I got hammered for saying that also.

When we came upon 'A' Company's lager site, I was walking point. A guy who
wrote a book about it said he was walking point. Who's to argue with an author
of a published book? That was John Leppelman and "Blood on the Risers."
The funny thing is that I saw the white powder on the trail and scooped it up
wondering what it was. The next stupid thing I did was sniff it. Strangely,
none of us could smell it when it was on the ground.

So, then I approached the site where 'A' Company spent the night. The powdered
teargas was scattered everywhere and was quit potent. My eyes burned and snot
was running out of my nose. I donned my gas mask a little too late. Anyway, I
led 'C' Company through the gas and set down my back pack. We were carrying two
dead men, so I helped the guys who were carrying them get through the gas.

After the last guy got through, I went back through the gas and made sure there
was no one left behind. When I got back to where I had left my backpack, it was
gone. It contained my camera and exposed film. Who took it?

I was left alone in the jungle with a rifle and some ammo not far from where 76
men had been killed in an ambush. I walked in the direction my Company took
hoping to connect with them. I did and without incident.

It was all surreal because when I told my squad leader that I had lost my
backpack, he said that if I didn't find it, he would courtmartial me. I took a
backpack off one of the dead troopers so I wouldn't be courtmartialed. In
retrospect, I think my squad leader had lost it mentally, but his threat seemed
real to me at the time.
!Jones
2017-04-11 13:03:20 UTC
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On 10 Apr 2017 21:56:14 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam dino
Post by dino
Yeah. I mentioned that (about the guys dumping the ammo) on the newsgroup many
years ago and I got hammered big time for saying it. I witnessed it, so fuck
it. Most of the guys who used to post here didn't have a real sense of the
reality of the Vietnam war or just didn't want to admit it. Probably more the
later than the former.
The teargas powder was left spread around in the foxholes so the NVA couldn't
use them. Never did they expect that the NVA could give a fuck less about their
crappy foxholes. Did you ever see NVA dug-in positions? They were masterfully
built to perfection. Yeah, and I got hammered for saying that also.
When we came upon 'A' Company's lager site, I was walking point. A guy who
wrote a book about it said he was walking point. Who's to argue with an author
of a published book? That was John Leppelman and "Blood on the Risers."
The funny thing is that I saw the white powder on the trail and scooped it up
wondering what it was. The next stupid thing I did was sniff it. Strangely,
none of us could smell it when it was on the ground.
So, then I approached the site where 'A' Company spent the night. The powdered
teargas was scattered everywhere and was quit potent. My eyes burned and snot
was running out of my nose. I donned my gas mask a little too late. Anyway, I
led 'C' Company through the gas and set down my back pack. We were carrying two
dead men, so I helped the guys who were carrying them get through the gas.
After the last guy got through, I went back through the gas and made sure there
was no one left behind. When I got back to where I had left my backpack, it was
gone. It contained my camera and exposed film. Who took it?
I was left alone in the jungle with a rifle and some ammo not far from where 76
men had been killed in an ambush. I walked in the direction my Company took
hoping to connect with them. I did and without incident.
It was all surreal because when I told my squad leader that I had lost my
backpack, he said that if I didn't find it, he would courtmartial me. I took a
backpack off one of the dead troopers so I wouldn't be courtmartialed. In
retrospect, I think my squad leader had lost it mentally, but his threat seemed
real to me at the time.
When you get right down to brass tacks, LBJ just weren't all *that*
bad... without the concepts of honor or decency, mind you, but also
without land mines and snipers. I wouldn't have been standing on that
ridge trembling at the thought of legal action for losing a pack, is
me pint... I'd have been worried, but not about the silly shit.

I wouldn't know one way or the other 'bout dropping the ammo; that's
what somebody who said he was there said... take it all with a grain
of salt. He also said that, as the survivors of Alpha company made
their way to the road, Charles blew a claymore on 'em and hit a few
more. I never saw that detail in any of the accounts.

OK, so... where the powder was (I think that shit's called "CN") was
Alpha's night position? I was thinking it was the ambush site and
have always wondered why they were so badly mauled; I mean, it looked
like decent ground for the defenders. I guess the Herd had been down
south playing around with our esteemed Australian allies and thought
that was how it *all* was... then they got their education that day,
huh? All of those NVA regiments that only six year-olds can see
aren't so bad.

Jones
Colonel Edmund J. Burke
2017-04-11 13:12:20 UTC
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CIC?

Council of Independent Churches?
LOL
dino
2017-04-12 02:07:39 UTC
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Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
He also said that, as the survivors of Alpha company made
their way to the road, Charles blew a claymore on 'em and
hit a few more. I never saw that detail in any of the
accounts.
I never heard of it either. I know some of the survivors went out on
helicopters. I thought they all did but maybe some didn't. Our Company stayed
put for three days looking for bodies.
Post by !Jones
OK, so... where the powder was (I think that shit's called
CN") was Alpha's night position? I was thinking it was the
ambush site and have always wondered why they were so badly
mauled; I mean, it looked like decent ground for the
defenders.
Yeah, it was in the night position that the powdered gas was spread about. The
ambush was very close to there. When I was left behind at there night position,
I walked the top of a ridge alone till I got to the site. Don't remember
exactly how far but not a great long ways.

They walked downhill from a ridge. I never saw any evidence of the enemy being
dug in. I think the rear of the column was still at the top when the front of
the column engaged the enemy further down the slope. At any rate the survivors
were at the top when we got there. They were able to hold that position but the
guys further down simply ran out of ammo. We did try to go down the slope that
day but met resistance so waited till the following morning. By then the enemy
had left. I still remember one guy still being alive, the only one left alive
that I saw.
RD Sandman
2017-04-11 15:58:19 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 15:22:11 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
My understanding is that he went to Oxford.
Am *I* suggesting that Bill Clinton was a great leader?
If I had had the opportunity, I'd have gone to Oxford... as opposed to
Dak To, I mean. If I had it to do over again, I'd immigrate to Canada
instead of going to Vietnam.
If I had done so, would I have gained your vote to be POTUS?
More to it than that.
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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!Jones
2017-04-11 21:43:48 UTC
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 10:58:19 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
Post by !Jones
If I had done so, would I have gained your vote to be POTUS?
More to it than that.
What if I had dyed my hair orange and channeled Patton's speech?

Jones
RD Sandman
2017-04-12 15:47:15 UTC
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 10:58:19 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
Post by !Jones
If I had done so, would I have gained your vote to be POTUS?
More to it than that.
What if I had dyed my hair orange and channeled Patton's speech?
Jones
I didn't vote for Chump.
--
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Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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!Jones
2017-04-12 20:35:10 UTC
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On Wed, 12 Apr 2017 10:47:15 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
I didn't vote for Chump.
In that case, you either:
1) voted for Hillary.
2) didn't bother to vote.
3) or wasted it on some turd party with no possible chance at all.

Jones
RD Sandman
2017-04-13 17:05:38 UTC
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On Wed, 12 Apr 2017 10:47:15 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
I didn't vote for Chump.
1) voted for Hillary.
2) didn't bother to vote.
3) or wasted it on some turd party with no possible chance at all.
Yep. I voted for Winnie the Pooh.
--
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!Jones
2017-04-13 17:35:42 UTC
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On Thu, 13 Apr 2017 12:05:38 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
Yep. I voted for Winnie the Pooh.
Good idea. At least it wasn't for Hillary; *two* points for you: it
wasn't Trump, either.

Of course, it ducked any responsibility.

Jones
RD Sandman
2017-04-13 18:07:18 UTC
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On Thu, 13 Apr 2017 12:05:38 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
Yep. I voted for Winnie the Pooh.
Good idea. At least it wasn't for Hillary; *two* points for you: it
wasn't Trump, either.
Of course, it ducked any responsibility.
I accept responsibility for my choice. I do not responsibility for Trump
--
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Wiley E. Coyote
2017-04-12 05:58:41 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 15:22:11 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
My understanding is that he went to Oxford.
Am *I* suggesting that Bill Clinton was a great leader?
If I had had the opportunity, I'd have gone to Oxford... as opposed to
Dak To, I mean. If I had it to do over again, I'd immigrate to Canada
instead of going to Vietnam.
If I had done so, would I have gained your vote to be POTUS?
Jones
Thank you for your service. Now shut the fuck up.
!Jones
2017-04-12 13:16:12 UTC
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On Wed, 12 Apr 2017 05:58:41 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley E.
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Now shut the fuck up.
I *think* I've just been flamed; are you flaming me, William?

That's not necessary, sir. This is a group of adults... most of the
time. (Well, *some* of the time, anyway.)

Jones
Stagger Lee
2017-04-12 15:56:20 UTC
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Post by !Jones
If I had done so, would I have gained your vote to be POTUS?
Jones
Thank you for your service. Now shut the fuck up.
LOL!
Wiley E. Coyote
2017-04-11 12:41:42 UTC
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On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 15:39:20 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley E.
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
What was you're opinion of Bill "the rapist" Clinton? He was alos a
renowbed draft dodger.
Agreed; however, you're changing the subject. Bush(43) and Cheney
also were both essentially draft dodgers; although, George did "serve"
in the Alabama national guard. TTBOMK, Bill Clinton never donned a
military uniform and paraded around as a warrior.
My issue is neither Clinton nor Bush; they're both long out of
office... my issue is Trump rattling the saber without a clue what
he's doing.
Jones
Bush, both of them were pilots. Sr was the youngest torpedo pilot in the US
navy in WWII and saw plnety of combat. W flew a Mach+, nuclear missile
capable interceptor and despite what you lying shits say did volunteer for a
rotation in Vietnam.

And I don't really care for either of them much. But denying the truth justs
makes you look small.
!Jones
2017-04-11 21:24:49 UTC
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 12:41:42 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley E.
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Bush, both of them were pilots. Sr was the youngest torpedo pilot in the US
navy in WWII and saw plnety of combat. W flew a Mach+, nuclear missile
capable interceptor and despite what you lying shits say did volunteer for a
rotation in Vietnam.
And I don't really care for either of them much. But denying the truth justs
makes you look small.
I liked Bush(41) OK and was less than happy when Clinton won the '92
election. Bush(43) was a decent human being and, despite what his
detractors say, I believe constitutionally honest... just not
particularly bright.

43 was qualified on thuds; however, the Alabama Air National Guard
only had six of them in the whole outfit. I dunno what a "mach+,
nuclear missile capable interceptor" is. A thud was envisioned as a
nuclear attack platform and capable of mach 1... I suppose that you
mean that it's capable of carrying a nuke. If he'd wanted to have
pulled a tour in 'Nam, he could easily have done so; they needed thud
drivers. There is no clear evidence that 43 ever actually flew one of
them, though.

I don't knock a man who chooses to stay out of the war if he can...
and it helps if you're from a powerful family.

But, you know... mostly, you're just kind of... pissy. And, I don't
really care for that. You're welcome to speak in this forum as is
everyone, but I dislike pissy people; therefore, I believe I will
filter you if it continues... as I'm sure it will, because you appear
to be intrinsically pissy.

Jones
Chinook Lover
2017-04-11 23:06:07 UTC
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 12:41:42 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley E.
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Bush, both of them were pilots. Sr was the youngest torpedo pilot in the US
navy in WWII and saw plnety of combat. W flew a Mach+, nuclear missile
capable interceptor and despite what you lying shits say did volunteer for a
rotation in Vietnam.
And I don't really care for either of them much. But denying the truth justs
makes you look small.
I liked Bush(41) OK and was less than happy when Clinton won the '92
election. Bush(43) was a decent human being and, despite what his
detractors say, I believe constitutionally honest... just not
particularly bright.
43 was qualified on thuds; however, the Alabama Air National Guard
only had six of them in the whole outfit. I dunno what a "mach+,
nuclear missile capable interceptor" is. A thud was envisioned as a
nuclear attack platform and capable of mach 1... I suppose that you
mean that it's capable of carrying a nuke. If he'd wanted to have
pulled a tour in 'Nam, he could easily have done so; they needed thud
drivers. There is no clear evidence that 43 ever actually flew one of
them, though.
Bush flew F102s in TANG not quite a Thud
Post by !Jones
I 't knock a man who chooses to stay out of the war if he can...
and it helps if you're from a powerful family.
But, you know... mostly, you're just kind of... pissy. And, I don't
really care for that. You're welcome to speak in this forum as is
everyone, but I dislike pissy people; therefore, I believe I will
filter you if it continues... as I'm sure it will, because you appear
to be intrinsically pissy.
Jones
--
"they called him 'stumpy' and his kidneys were end-stage as well. we
gonna try fistula surgery again...a little higher up"

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!Jones
2017-04-11 23:57:22 UTC
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 18:06:07 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
Bush flew F102s in TANG not quite a Thud
OK, I guess it was 102s. I don't recall ever seeing one of those... I
probably did, though.

Jones
Chinook Lover
2017-04-12 01:08:41 UTC
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 18:06:07 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
Bush flew F102s in TANG not quite a Thud
OK, I guess it was 102s. I don't recall ever seeing one of those... I
probably did, though.
Jones
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they were in Austin...can't recall the name of the base but I think it's
the airport now I'm vaguely familiar with the NG base at Camp Mabry.
I hate it when you can't recall shit. Bergstrom was the base for
TANG flush!!! nighty night
--
"they called him 'stumpy' and his kidneys were end-stage as well. we
gonna try fistula surgery again...a little higher up"
!Jones
2017-04-12 13:02:43 UTC
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 20:08:41 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
they were in Austin...can't recall the name of the base but I think it's
the airport now I'm vaguely familiar with the NG base at Camp Mabry.
I hate it when you can't recall shit. Bergstrom was the base for
TANG flush!!! nighty night
Bergstrom was the air force base. The TANG had some hanger space on
the north side of the municipal airport; however, I never saw any
102s. But, then... by '75, when I got home, they were about as
obsolete as dinosaurs. Besides, they could have had UFOs at Bergstrom
and I'd not have known.

Jones
RD Sandman
2017-04-12 15:54:18 UTC
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 18:06:07 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
Bush flew F102s in TANG not quite a Thud
OK, I guess it was 102s. I don't recall ever seeing one of those... I
probably did, though.
It was a delta wing fighter interceptor. Its main purpose was defending
the homeland against Russian bombers that may have come over the Arctic
approach. None did. The F-102 saw very limited action in Nam.
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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2017-04-12 15:52:21 UTC
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 12:41:42 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Bush, both of them were pilots. Sr was the youngest torpedo pilot in
the US navy in WWII and saw plnety of combat. W flew a Mach+,
nuclear missile capable interceptor and despite what you lying shits
say did volunteer for a rotation in Vietnam.
And I don't really care for either of them much. But denying the
truth justs makes you look small.
I liked Bush(41) OK and was less than happy when Clinton won the '92
election. Bush(43) was a decent human being and, despite what his
detractors say, I believe constitutionally honest... just not
particularly bright.
43 was qualified on thuds; however, the Alabama Air National Guard
only had six of them in the whole outfit. I dunno what a "mach+,
nuclear missile capable interceptor" is. A thud was envisioned as a
nuclear attack platform and capable of mach 1... I suppose that you
mean that it's capable of carrying a nuke. If he'd wanted to have
pulled a tour in 'Nam, he could easily have done so; they needed thud
drivers. There is no clear evidence that 43 ever actually flew one
of them, though.
Bush flew F102s in TANG not quite a Thud
Correct. They don't even look alike.
Post by Chinook Lover
Post by !Jones
I 't knock a man who chooses to stay out of the war if he can...
and it helps if you're from a powerful family.
But, you know... mostly, you're just kind of... pissy. And, I don't
really care for that. You're welcome to speak in this forum as is
everyone, but I dislike pissy people; therefore, I believe I will
filter you if it continues... as I'm sure it will, because you appear
to be intrinsically pissy.
Jones
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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Chinook Lover
2017-04-12 22:08:49 UTC
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Post by Chinook Lover
Post by !Jones
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 12:41:42 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Bush, both of them were pilots. Sr was the youngest torpedo pilot in
the US navy in WWII and saw plnety of combat. W flew a Mach+,
nuclear missile capable interceptor and despite what you lying shits
say did volunteer for a rotation in Vietnam.
And I don't really care for either of them much. But denying the
truth justs makes you look small.
I liked Bush(41) OK and was less than happy when Clinton won the '92
election. Bush(43) was a decent human being and, despite what his
detractors say, I believe constitutionally honest... just not
particularly bright.
43 was qualified on thuds; however, the Alabama Air National Guard
only had six of them in the whole outfit. I dunno what a "mach+,
nuclear missile capable interceptor" is. A thud was envisioned as a
nuclear attack platform and capable of mach 1... I suppose that you
mean that it's capable of carrying a nuke. If he'd wanted to have
pulled a tour in 'Nam, he could easily have done so; they needed thud
drivers. There is no clear evidence that 43 ever actually flew one
of them, though.
Bush flew F102s in TANG not quite a Thud
Correct. They don't even look alike.
I understand the 102 was a handful to fly and not make the "thud" sound
Post by RD Sandman
Post by Chinook Lover
Post by !Jones
I 't knock a man who chooses to stay out of the war if he can...
and it helps if you're from a powerful family.
But, you know... mostly, you're just kind of... pissy. And, I don't
really care for that. You're welcome to speak in this forum as is
everyone, but I dislike pissy people; therefore, I believe I will
filter you if it continues... as I'm sure it will, because you appear
to be intrinsically pissy.
Jones
--
"they called him 'stumpy' and his kidneys were end-stage as well. we
gonna try fistula surgery again...a little higher up"

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2017-04-13 17:08:39 UTC
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Post by Chinook Lover
Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 12:41:42 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Bush, both of them were pilots. Sr was the youngest torpedo pilot in
the US navy in WWII and saw plnety of combat. W flew a Mach+,
nuclear missile capable interceptor and despite what you lying shits
say did volunteer for a rotation in Vietnam.
And I don't really care for either of them much. But denying the
truth justs makes you look small.
I liked Bush(41) OK and was less than happy when Clinton won the '92
election. Bush(43) was a decent human being and, despite what his
detractors say, I believe constitutionally honest... just not
particularly bright.
43 was qualified on thuds; however, the Alabama Air National Guard
only had six of them in the whole outfit. I dunno what a "mach+,
nuclear missile capable interceptor" is. A thud was envisioned as a
nuclear attack platform and capable of mach 1... I suppose that you
mean that it's capable of carrying a nuke. If he'd wanted to have
pulled a tour in 'Nam, he could easily have done so; they needed thud
drivers. There is no clear evidence that 43 ever actually flew one
of them, though.
Bush flew F102s in TANG not quite a Thud
Correct. They don't even look alike.
I understand the 102 was a handful to fly and not make the "thud" sound
It was. The F-106 was what the F-102 should have been with the right
engine and some other mods.
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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2017-04-12 15:51:50 UTC
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 12:41:42 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley E.
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Bush, both of them were pilots. Sr was the youngest torpedo pilot in
the US navy in WWII and saw plnety of combat. W flew a Mach+, nuclear
missile capable interceptor and despite what you lying shits say did
volunteer for a rotation in Vietnam.
And I don't really care for either of them much. But denying the truth
justs makes you look small.
I liked Bush(41) OK and was less than happy when Clinton won the '92
election. Bush(43) was a decent human being and, despite what his
detractors say, I believe constitutionally honest... just not
particularly bright.
43 was qualified on thuds;
43 was qualified and flew F-102 Delta Dagger. A Thud is an F-105
Thunderchief. It was used as a fighter bomber in Nam. Look up Thud Ridge.


however, the Alabama Air National Guard
Post by !Jones
only had six of them in the whole outfit. I dunno what a "mach+,
nuclear missile capable interceptor" is.
In W's case, it was an F-102.
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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2017-04-12 20:50:56 UTC
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On Wed, 12 Apr 2017 10:51:50 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
Look up Thud Ridge.
"Thud Ridge" was a line of high ground not far north of Hanoi. US
bombers would drop low behind it, pop over and say: "Suprise, suprise,
suprise!" to the defenders. Then Charlie wised up and fortified it
with a whole shit-load of AAA. Next time we tried that, it was:
"Suprise, sup..." <THUD!!!>

It had nothing to do with the F-105, save that these were our
workhorse tactical bombers.

I always thought the venerable Thud got a bad rap. He was flown
during the absolute height of the war into impossible situations.
That Ruskie AAA was damned effective and the northern targets were
ringed with it. If they couldn't get a Buff in there with any chance
of survival, they'd send the Thuds... then blamed 'em for getting shot
outta the sky.

Jones
RD Sandman
2017-04-13 17:07:16 UTC
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On Wed, 12 Apr 2017 10:51:50 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
Look up Thud Ridge.
"Thud Ridge" was a line of high ground not far north of Hanoi. US
bombers would drop low behind it, pop over and say: "Suprise, suprise,
suprise!" to the defenders. Then Charlie wised up and fortified it
"Suprise, sup..." <THUD!!!>
It had nothing to do with the F-105, save that these were our
workhorse tactical bombers.
As I said, look at Thud Ridge. There was more than one reason for the
nickname.
Post by !Jones
I always thought the venerable Thud got a bad rap. He was flown
during the absolute height of the war into impossible situations.
That Ruskie AAA was damned effective and the northern targets were
ringed with it. If they couldn't get a Buff in there with any chance
of survival, they'd send the Thuds... then blamed 'em for getting shot
outta the sky.
Jones
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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!Jones
2017-04-13 17:40:18 UTC
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On Thu, 13 Apr 2017 12:07:16 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
As I said, look at Thud Ridge. There was more than one reason for the
nickname.
Well, some say that the "Thud" was named after the ridge. Some say
visa versa. The F105 was (somewhat "incorrectly") named the
"Thunderchief". There was a Howdy-Doody character named "Chief
Thunderthud" about the same time.

"Thud" was the sound an aircraft made when it hit the ground.

What else do you need to know?

Jones
RD Sandman
2017-04-13 18:08:26 UTC
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On Thu, 13 Apr 2017 12:07:16 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
As I said, look at Thud Ridge. There was more than one reason for the
nickname.
Well, some say that the "Thud" was named after the ridge. Some say
visa versa. The F105 was (somewhat "incorrectly") named the
"Thunderchief". There was a Howdy-Doody character named "Chief
Thunderthud" about the same time.
"Thud" was the sound an aircraft made when it hit the ground.
What else do you need to know?
Nothing. It was simply a comment.
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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Just Wondering
2017-04-09 18:06:17 UTC
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On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 11:30:15 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam Klaus
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President. In fact, it's
unnecessary.
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
As POTUS, one is also the commander in chief of all US military
forces; therefore, being a draft dodger is not a particularly good
recommendation.
Since the choice was between Hiliary and Trump, please tell us all about
Hiliary's extensive military record.
RD Sandman
2017-04-09 19:03:39 UTC
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Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 11:30:15 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam Klaus
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President. In fact, it's
unnecessary.
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
As POTUS, one is also the commander in chief of all US military
forces; therefore, being a draft dodger is not a particularly good
recommendation.
Since the choice was between Hiliary and Trump, please tell us all about
Hiliary's extensive military record.
BFG ;)
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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JackPineSavage
2017-04-09 20:59:27 UTC
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Post by Just Wondering
Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 11:30:15 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam Klaus
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President. In fact, it's
unnecessary.
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
As POTUS, one is also the commander in chief of all US military
forces; therefore, being a draft dodger is not a particularly good
recommendation.
Since the choice was between Hiliary and Trump, please tell us all about
Hiliary's extensive military record.
Well, there WAS that sniper at the Tuzla airport.....
RD Sandman
2017-04-10 20:19:31 UTC
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Post by JackPineSavage
Post by Just Wondering
Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 11:30:15 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam Klaus
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President. In fact, it's
unnecessary.
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting
in Vietnam gets extra points.
As POTUS, one is also the commander in chief of all US military
forces; therefore, being a draft dodger is not a particularly good
recommendation.
Since the choice was between Hiliary and Trump, please tell us all
about Hiliary's extensive military record.
Well, there WAS that sniper at the Tuzla airport.....
;) Geraldo also claimed one of those.
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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!Jones
2017-04-10 22:01:31 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 15:19:31 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
Geraldo also claimed one of those.
Why can't one of 'em nail him?

Jones
RD Sandman
2017-04-11 15:57:30 UTC
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Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 15:19:31 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
Geraldo also claimed one of those.
Why can't one of 'em nail him?
He seems to be a chameleon. He attended University of Arizona for awhile
under the name of Jerry Rivers. Apparently he did feel strongly about his
Hispanic heritage until he realized it could gain him a job and some money.
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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!Jones
2017-04-11 21:33:41 UTC
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On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 10:57:30 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
He seems to be a chameleon. He attended University of Arizona for awhile
under the name of Jerry Rivers. Apparently he did feel strongly about his
Hispanic heritage until he realized it could gain him a job and some money.
Yeah, well... you do what you gotta do. I applauded back in November
of '88 when he had his nose broken in that studio fray; I don't really
care which side broke it so long as *somebody* did. It made my day!

Jones
Chinook Lover
2017-04-11 23:08:16 UTC
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Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Tue, 11 Apr 2017 10:57:30 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
He seems to be a chameleon. He attended University of Arizona for awhile
under the name of Jerry Rivers. Apparently he did feel strongly about his
Hispanic heritage until he realized it could gain him a job and some money.
Yeah, well... you do what you gotta do. I applauded back in November
of '88 when he had his nose broken in that studio fray; I don't really
care which side broke it so long as *somebody* did. It made my day!
Jones
he certainly got his hair mussed
--
"they called him 'stumpy' and his kidneys were end-stage as well. we
gonna try fistula surgery again...a little higher up"

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!Jones
2017-04-10 00:18:34 UTC
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On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 12:06:17 -0600, in alt.war.vietnam Just Wondering
Post by Just Wondering
Since the choice was between Hiliary and Trump, please tell us all about
Hiliary's extensive military record.
You people keep changing the subject; Hillary Clinton is not the
president (praise the Lord!) Had the democrats had any sense, Trump
wouldn't be, either. Had Hillary become POTUS and started lobbing
cruise missiles, I would have expressed a similar misgiving.

Now... back to Trump, please.

Jones
Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
2017-04-11 15:30:35 UTC
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Post by Just Wondering
Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 11:30:15 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam Klaus
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President. In fact, it's
unnecessary.
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
As POTUS, one is also the commander in chief of all US military
forces; therefore, being a draft dodger is not a particularly good
recommendation.
Since the choice was between Hiliary and Trump, please tell us all about
Hiliary's extensive military record.
None, and she is a war-monger too.

Either way, war escalation, and possibly serious nuclear
brinkmanship, is in our future.
pyotr filipivich
2017-04-11 16:27:55 UTC
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Let the Record show that "Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D." <***@coldine.edu>
on or about Tue, 11 Apr 2017 08:30:35 -0700 did write, type or
Post by Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
Post by Just Wondering
Post by !Jones
On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 11:30:15 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam Klaus
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President. In fact, it's
unnecessary.
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
As POTUS, one is also the commander in chief of all US military
forces; therefore, being a draft dodger is not a particularly good
recommendation.
Since the choice was between Hiliary and Trump, please tell us all about
Hiliary's extensive military record.
None, and she is a war-monger too.
Either way, war escalation, and possibly serious nuclear
brinkmanship, is in our future.
Obama's legacy - a world at war, and more unstable.

"Leading from behind" results in that. When the "leadership"
decides it doesn't want to participate on the world stage, the next
office holder is left with "accept the mess" or try to regain
position.
--
pyotr filipivich
"Quemadmoeum gladuis neminem occidit, occidentis telum est. "
Lucius Annaeus Seneca, circa 45 AD
(A sword is never a killer, it is a tool in the killer's hands.)
RD Sandman
2017-04-09 19:02:30 UTC
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Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Sat, 08 Apr 2017 11:30:15 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam Klaus
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President. In fact, it's
unnecessary.
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
As POTUS, one is also the commander in chief of all US military
forces; therefore, being a draft dodger is not a particularly good
recommendation.
Nor is it a particularly bad one.
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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!Jones
2017-04-10 00:14:39 UTC
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On Sun, 09 Apr 2017 14:02:30 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
Nor is it a particularly bad one.
Heh! You'd say that it would be if the president were a democrat, I'd
wager.

Jones
RD Sandman
2017-04-10 20:18:49 UTC
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Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Sun, 09 Apr 2017 14:02:30 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
Nor is it a particularly bad one.
Heh! You'd say that it would be if the president were a democrat, I'd
wager.
If she had won, she would have been..not draft dodger but one who had not
served. FWIW, you don't know me as well as you think you do. I am pretty
much apolitical.
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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!Jones
2017-04-10 22:00:27 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 15:18:49 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
If she had won, she would have been..not draft dodger but one who had not
served. FWIW, you don't know me as well as you think you do. I am pretty
much apolitical.
I'll take you at your word. I, also, lack a clear political dogma.

I was *seriously* unhappy with my alternative choice to Trump; I'd
much sooner have eaten a bug than voted for Clinton.

Had she won, we would have all lost... as we lost when Trump "won".
We just didn't have any winners in that election.

Can we agree on that?

Jones
RD Sandman
2017-04-11 15:55:48 UTC
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Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 15:18:49 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam RD Sandman
Post by RD Sandman
If she had won, she would have been..not draft dodger but one who had
not served. FWIW, you don't know me as well as you think you do. I am
pretty much apolitical.
I'll take you at your word. I, also, lack a clear political dogma.
I was *seriously* unhappy with my alternative choice to Trump; I'd
much sooner have eaten a bug than voted for Clinton.
Had she won, we would have all lost... as we lost when Trump "won".
We just didn't have any winners in that election.
Can we agree on that?
Yep.
--
RD Sandman

Airspeed, altitude and brains....two of the three are always
required to complete a mission.

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Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
2017-04-09 07:38:48 UTC
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Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President.
yep...take POW McCain...his experience has made him a nutjob war-monger.

Or say, 4 years of swabbing decks on an aircraft carrier...how
in hell is that experience good for anything...
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
yep...avoided murdering Vietnamese people...they've kept their honor
;-)
Wiley E. Coyote
2017-04-09 15:40:53 UTC
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Post by Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President.
yep...take POW McCain...his experience has made him a nutjob war-monger.
Or say, 4 years of swabbing decks on an aircraft carrier...how
in hell is that experience good for anything...
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
yep...avoided murdering Vietnamese people...they've kept their honor
;-)
You are beyond stupid.

Your Ph D stands for Piled Higher and Deeper
Jack G
2017-04-09 15:52:09 UTC
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Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Post by Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President.
yep...take POW McCain...his experience has made him a nutjob war-monger.
Or say, 4 years of swabbing decks on an aircraft carrier...how
in hell is that experience good for anything...
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
yep...avoided murdering Vietnamese people...they've kept their honor
;-)
You are beyond stupid.
Your Ph D stands for Piled Higher and Deeper
It is best just to ignore him. He has done nothing and knows nothing.
de chucka
2017-04-09 18:29:02 UTC
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Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Post by Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President.
yep...take POW McCain...his experience has made him a nutjob war-monger.
Or say, 4 years of swabbing decks on an aircraft carrier...how
in hell is that experience good for anything...
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
yep...avoided murdering Vietnamese people...they've kept their honor
;-)
You are beyond stupid.
Your Ph D stands for Piled Higher and Deeper
and you supply the BS
Just Wondering
2017-04-09 22:29:09 UTC
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Post by de chucka
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Post by Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President.
yep...take POW McCain...his experience has made him a nutjob war-monger.
Or say, 4 years of swabbing decks on an aircraft carrier...how
in hell is that experience good for anything...
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
yep...avoided murdering Vietnamese people...they've kept their honor
;-)
You are beyond stupid.
Your Ph D stands for Piled Higher and Deeper
and you supply the BS
and you supply More of the Same.
Wiley E. Coyote
2017-04-10 07:39:55 UTC
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Post by Just Wondering
Post by de chucka
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Post by Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President.
yep...take POW McCain...his experience has made him a nutjob war-monger.
Or say, 4 years of swabbing decks on an aircraft carrier...how
in hell is that experience good for anything...
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
yep...avoided murdering Vietnamese people...they've kept their honor
;-)
You are beyond stupid.
Your Ph D stands for Piled Higher and Deeper
and you supply the BS
and you supply More of the Same.
What do you expect? He's a roo fucking shackle dragger.
Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
2017-04-11 15:31:37 UTC
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Post by Just Wondering
Post by de chucka
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Post by Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President.
yep...take POW McCain...his experience has made him a nutjob war-monger.
Or say, 4 years of swabbing decks on an aircraft carrier...how
in hell is that experience good for anything...
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
yep...avoided murdering Vietnamese people...they've kept their honor
;-)
You are beyond stupid.
Your Ph D stands for Piled Higher and Deeper
and you supply the BS
and you supply More of the Same.
and your mama has fat thighs.
Just Wondering
2017-04-11 20:44:00 UTC
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Post by Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
Post by Just Wondering
Post by de chucka
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
Post by Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Military experience isn't required to be President.
yep...take POW McCain...his experience has made him a nutjob war-monger.
Or say, 4 years of swabbing decks on an aircraft carrier...how
in hell is that experience good for anything...
Post by Klaus Schadenfreude
Anyone who had the good sense to use The System to avoid fighting in
Vietnam gets extra points.
yep...avoided murdering Vietnamese people...they've kept their honor
;-)
You are beyond stupid.
Your Ph D stands for Piled Higher and Deeper
and you supply the BS
and you supply More of the Same.
and your mama has fat thighs.
My mother passed away 20+ years ago due to complications of diabetes.
!Jones
2017-04-10 00:24:37 UTC
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x-no-idiots: yes

On Sun, 9 Apr 2017 15:40:53 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley E.
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
You are beyond stupid.
Jeeze! "There we were, shaking hands in the middle of the road when
we were hit by a truck."

Jones
!Jones
2017-04-10 00:23:31 UTC
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On Sun, 09 Apr 2017 00:38:48 -0700, in alt.war.vietnam "Dr. Vincent
Post by Dr. Vincent Quin, Ph.D.
yep...avoided murdering Vietnamese people...they've kept their honor
;-)
Vinnie, you are truly an embarrassment to any sentient human being
without regard to race, creed, or political ideology.

Jones... who says: "kill the orphans!"

P.S. And rape the nuns, of course.
Richard Milhouse Obama
2017-04-09 22:37:16 UTC
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Post by !Jones
I was always glad that we weren't at war during the Clinton
administration... Bill was essentially a draft dodger. Bush
was a *little* bit better; he joined the Alabama Air National
Guard which, of course, was close to being a draft dodger
without actually moving to England. Now, we have Trump...
who unapologetically bought his deferments.
Even his most ardent supporters say they should pin a medal on him
for not getting AIDS through allegedly raping all those underaged
boys and girls. Sean Hannity gushes all over him during
interviews and we all know that he was another brave warrior.


Most of his supporters are gutless white trash queers who bleed
from the asshole and whine all day about what losers in life they
are.
Wiley E. Coyote
2017-04-10 08:03:24 UTC
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!Jones <¡***@fubahor.com> wrote in news:5v8iechsr0sa4n1o1emvdefas9vl6v5lou@
4ax.com:
If you think that is our greatest problem you are more stupid than I
previously beleived you to be. And I really thought you were stupid.
!Jones
2017-04-10 12:51:39 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 08:03:24 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley E.
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
If you think that is our greatest problem you are more stupid than I
previously beleived you to be. And I really thought you were stupid.
Well, our greatest problem is that the American people have lost the
ability to discern and act upon the truth. Instead, we are driven
solely by our ideological orientation. For this reason, our
candidates have become caricatures of either extreme.

I had seen this coming for a few years; however, it finally became
obvious in the 2016 election when our system failed to produce a
viable presidential candidate from either party. Donald Trump is a
bad joke and obviously unfit to lead the nation; I'm not saying that I
believe Hillary Clinton would be any better... I'm saying that we, as
a people, cannot see the fact that our candidate, from which ever side
of the spectrum it is we shriek, is an unfit leader.

Jones
Chinook Lover
2017-04-10 13:20:30 UTC
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Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 08:03:24 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley E.
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
If you think that is our greatest problem you are more stupid than I
previously beleived you to be. And I really thought you were stupid.
Well, our greatest problem is that the American people have lost the
ability to discern and act upon the truth. Instead, we are driven
solely by our ideological orientation. For this reason, our
candidates have become caricatures of either extreme.
I had seen this coming for a few years; however, it finally became
obvious in the 2016 election when our system failed to produce a
viable presidential candidate from either party. Donald Trump is a
bad joke and obviously unfit to lead the nation; I'm not saying that I
believe Hillary Clinton would be any better... I'm saying that we, as
a people, cannot see the fact that our candidate, from which ever side
of the spectrum it is we shriek, is an unfit leader.
Jones
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speaking of Hill-babe, ya know her tan lines are between the wrinkles???
scary, huh?
--
"they called him 'stumpy' and his kidneys were end-stage as well. we
gonna try fistula surgery again...a little higher up"
!Jones
2017-04-10 13:44:54 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 08:20:30 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
speaking of Hill-babe, ya know her tan lines are between the wrinkles???
scary, huh?
Oh, I wouldn't vote for or against a person based on physical
appearance... if we did *that*, we'd probably have elected that
bobble-head from Alaska (McCain's running mate in '08, whatever her
name was) in a landslide. Lindsey Lohan for president? How 'bout
Justin Bieber? I shudder at the thought!

The upside of that mentality is that we surely wouldn't have elected
Donald. That's how we elected Kennedy, you know... I would hesitate
to call him a great leader.

Jones
Chinook Lover
2017-04-10 19:44:13 UTC
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Post by !Jones
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 08:20:30 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
speaking of Hill-babe, ya know her tan lines are between the wrinkles???
scary, huh?
Oh, I wouldn't vote for or against a person based on physical
appearance... if we did *that*, we'd probably have elected that
bobble-head from Alaska (McCain's running mate in '08, whatever her
name was) in a landslide. Lindsey Lohan for president? How 'bout
Justin Bieber? I shudder at the thought!
The upside of that mentality is that we surely wouldn't have elected
Donald. That's how we elected Kennedy, you know... I would hesitate
to call him a great leader.
Jones
a great target perhaps...
--
"they called him 'stumpy' and his kidneys were end-stage as well. we
gonna try fistula surgery again...a little higher up"

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!Jones
2017-04-10 20:16:41 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 14:44:13 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
a great target perhaps...
That shooter was either very good or very lucky; maybe a bit of both.
Chinook Lover
2017-04-10 23:18:11 UTC
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Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 14:44:13 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
a great target perhaps...
That shooter was either very good or very lucky; maybe a bit of both.
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there's a video of a Marine SGM rallying the troops going into
Fallujah?? citing Whitman and Oswald as examples of Marine marksmanship.
--
"they called him 'stumpy' and his kidneys were end-stage as well. we
gonna try fistula surgery again...a little higher up"
!Jones
2017-04-11 01:10:49 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 18:18:11 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
there's a video of a Marine SGM rallying the troops going into
Fallujah?? citing Whitman and Oswald as examples of Marine marksmanship.
The best one is old R. Lee Ermey in *Full Metal Jacket*; I believe it
to be one of the best Vietnam flicks ever made (well, perhaps:
*Apocalypse Now*?) and all of the Hue scenes were shot at an abandoned
gas works near London. I liked Vincent D'Onofrio's character;
however, I've never seen him totally bomb.

Jones
First-Post
2017-04-11 02:42:40 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 18:18:11 -0500, Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 14:44:13 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
a great target perhaps...
That shooter was either very good or very lucky; maybe a bit of both.
---
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there's a video of a Marine SGM rallying the troops going into
Fallujah?? citing Whitman and Oswald as examples of Marine marksmanship.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKbtvxAX_jI

Having trouble separating fantasy from reality are ya?
!Jones
2017-04-11 03:22:02 UTC
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On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 21:42:40 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam First-Post
Post by First-Post
Having trouble separating fantasy from reality are ya?
We take drugs because they're cool. If you take enough, it doesn't
matter.

Fuck off.

Jones
Chinook Lover
2017-04-11 18:58:31 UTC
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Post by First-Post
On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 18:18:11 -0500, Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
Post by !Jones
x-no-idiots: yes
On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 14:44:13 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
a great target perhaps...
That shooter was either very good or very lucky; maybe a bit of both.
---
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
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there's a video of a Marine SGM rallying the troops going into
Fallujah?? citing Whitman and Oswald as examples of Marine marksmanship.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uKbtvxAX_jI
Having trouble separating fantasy from reality are ya?
my bad...fact is:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8v2_QIhk0jQ

more impressive than R. Lee so bite me
--
"they called him 'stumpy' and his kidneys were end-stage as well. we
gonna try fistula surgery again...a little higher up"
Just Wondering
2017-04-11 01:24:29 UTC
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Post by !Jones
Oh, I wouldn't vote for or against a person based on physical
appearance... if we did *that*, we'd probably have elected that
bobble-head from Alaska (McCain's running mate in '08, whatever her
name was) in a landslide. Lindsey Lohan for president? How 'bout
Justin Bieber? I shudder at the thought!
No worries there, he's not a natural born U.S. citizen - and he's not 35
years old.
Wiley E. Coyote
2017-04-11 12:43:14 UTC
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x-no-idiots: yes
On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 08:20:30 -0500, in alt.war.vietnam Chinook Lover
Post by Chinook Lover
speaking of Hill-babe, ya know her tan lines are between the wrinkles???
scary, huh?
Oh, I wouldn't vote for or against a person based on physical
appearance... if we did *that*, we'd probably have elected that
bobble-head from Alaska (McCain's running mate in '08, whatever her
name was) in a landslide. Lindsey Lohan for president? How 'bout
Justin Bieber? I shudder at the thought!
The upside of that mentality is that we surely wouldn't have elected
Donald. That's how we elected Kennedy, you know... I would hesitate
to call him a great leader.
Jones
I wouldn't hesitate to call ypou part of the problem.
!Jones
2017-04-11 14:54:19 UTC
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x-no-idiots: yes

My x-filter obviously isn't working.

Jones
Just Wondering
2017-04-11 01:21:24 UTC
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x-no-idiots: yes
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
If you think that is our greatest problem you are more stupid than I
previously beleived you to be. And I really thought you were stupid.
Well, our greatest problem is that the American people have lost the
ability to discern and act upon the truth. Instead, we are driven
solely by our ideological orientation. For this reason, our
candidates have become caricatures of either extreme.
I had seen this coming for a few years; however, it finally became
obvious in the 2016 election when our system failed to produce a
viable presidential candidate from either party. Donald Trump is a
bad joke and obviously unfit to lead the nation; I'm not saying that I
believe Hillary Clinton would be any better... I'm saying that we, as
a people, cannot see the fact that our candidate, from which ever side
of the spectrum it is we shriek, is an unfit leader.
Kiefer Sutherland seems to be doing OK.
Wiley E. Coyote
2017-04-11 12:37:46 UTC
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x-no-idiots: yes
On Mon, 10 Apr 2017 08:03:24 -0000 (UTC), in alt.war.vietnam "Wiley E.
Post by Wiley E. Coyote
If you think that is our greatest problem you are more stupid than I
previously beleived you to be. And I really thought you were stupid.
Well, our greatest problem is that the American people have lost the
ability to discern and act upon the truth.
Speak for yourself. How many lies have you been caught in?
!Jones
2017-04-11 14:56:07 UTC
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x-no-idiots: yes

I don't have a clue who you are. You can't nym-shift all over the
spectrum and expect people to recognize you... not that we care, mind
you.

Jones
Colonel Edmund J. Burke
2017-04-10 14:01:22 UTC
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CIC?

Certified Insurance Councillor?
LOL
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